潛射雄二

choi

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羅添斌, 潛射雄二測評 劍龍級潛艦大升級. Liberty Times, July 7, 2011.
http://www.libertytimes.com.tw/2011/new/jul/7/today-p1.htm

My comment: I read the news upon its publication at 3 pm. My impression was Taiwan's aim was aspirational, rather than a reality. After all,
(a) China announced the capability in mid-1980s but Annual Report to Congress: Military and Secutiry Developments Involving the People's Republic of China. 2010, by US Department of Defense, stated that enither JL-1 nor -2 was operational.
(b) Taiwan is not known to make its own torpedoes but has bought from US for decades. And I guess, just guess, capability to make a torpedo comes before that for a submarine-launched missile.
and (c) Not many nations are

HOWEVER, today this reports came out, based on the above report, which indicates Taiwan has tried though outcomes were unknown:

Taiwan 'tests sub-launched missile.' AFP, July 7, 2011 (9 hours ago).
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5io6AwoNtZqbDPaS4t07IVTjXqg0A?docId=CNG.7e8ac63ac69f01c5fe7b5509115459b3.31

(c) submarine-launched missile
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine-launched_missile

The list includes India's BrahMos, as well as China's YJ-82.

(i) "The Indian Navy operates a fleet of diesel-electric submarines of the Sindhughosh and Shishumar classes."
Indian Navy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Navy

It does not have nuclear-powered submarine--yet (Russia might lease one in the coming October). But none of India's current submarine can shoot missiles. The most India has done is test a missiel from a underwater platform (see (d) below).

Indeed, click BrahMos, you will read, "Variants: [among others] Submarine launched, Anti-Ship variant (under development, expected completion 2011)."

(ii) Harpoon (missile)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harpoon_(missile)

Quote: "At least 339 Harpoon missiles were sold to the Republic of China Air Force (Taiwan) for its F-16 A/B Block 20 fleet and the Taiwanese Navy, which operates four guided-missile destroyers and sixteen guided-missile frigates with the capability of carrying the Harpoon, include the eight former U.S. Navy Knox class frigates and the eight locally-built derivative of the Oliver Hazard Perry class frigates. There are also the four former U.S.N. Kidd class guided-missile destroyers, which have been sold to Taiwan and have the capability of carrying Harpoon missiles. Plus the 2 Zwaardvis/Hai Lung submarines and 12 P-3C can launch Harpoon missiles.

Note: Wiki provvides no reference for this paragraph.

(d) submarine-launched ballistic missile
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine-launched_ballistic_missile

(i) Sagarika (missile)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sagarika_(missile)
(K-15 Sagarika (Sanskrit for Oceanic) is a nuclear-capable submarine launched ballistic missile with a range of 700 kilometres (435 mi); The missile was successfully test fired six times, and tested to its full range up to three times. The tests of February 26, 2008 was conducted from a submerged pontoon 50 metres (160 ft) beneath the surface off the coast of Visakhapatnam)

(e) I re-read the Liberty Times report just now, which is ambiguious. Even if Taiwan succeeds in firing HF-2E and or Harpoon missiles from a submarine (or two), it is unclear whether the submarines was above or under water. If the submarine(s) has to emerge before firing either missiles, it is not much of a deterent, but rather a suicide.

But see
台湾媒体称军方试验潜射雄风导弹.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/chinese_news/2011/07/110707_taiwan_china_missile.shtml

Quote:

台湾《自由时报》"报道还说，台湾军方费时5年，将原先为水面上舰艇发射的雄风二型导弹改装成为具有水下发射能力的反舰导弹。

"雄风二型反舰导弹自成军到现在已经20多年，根据台湾媒体先前的报道，潜射式的该型导弹也默默发展了至少十多年。

Quotation 1 is not seen in the online version of teh Liberty Times report. Yet I always believe that a print report in Taiwan must be considerably longer than the online version, for the simple reason that a copy of newspaper in Taiwan is like that in US: it is as thick as a mini-book.

(f) Hai Lung class submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hai_Lung_class_submarine

Quote:

"In 2005, it was reported that the Hai Lung class submarines would be upgraded to be capable of launching the UGM-84 Harpoon anti-ship missile.[1]

"In 2008, the Pentagon notified the United States Congress of the sale to Taiwan of 32 UGM-84 Harpoon Block II missiles, along with two weapon control systems, other associated equipment and services.[2]

Note:
* Reference 1 is:
Taiwan to boost submarine force with Harpoon anti-ship missiles: Jane's. AFP, Sept 25, 2005.
http://www.spacewar.com/2005/050925045232.0c99y2bv.html
* In Taiwan, Zwaardvis class submarine is translated as 劍龍級潛艦 (zwaardvis is Dutch for "swordfish") and the two Taiwan-owned submarine is simply called 海龍 (the lead submarine), 海虎 (both of which are only occasionally categorized as 海龍級).  

(g) At long last, I will return to a recent failture, which Taiwan military explained was produced in 2005 when technology was not mature.

羅添斌, 軍方首度證實：雄三飛彈 曾應急戰備部署. Liberty Times, June 29, 2011
http://www.libertytimes.com.tw/2011/new/jun/29/today-p3.htm


-------------------------------------Separately
(1) Miles Yu, Inside China. Washington Times, July 7, 2011
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/jul/6/inside-china-988747365/
("Xue Li of the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, on June 8 published an eye-catching article in the official Global Times newspaper that boldly challenged territorial claims made by Indonesia, Malaysia and Singapore over the waters of the Malaccan Strait. * * * [China should] insist on having the right to send Chinese naval ships to the strait to 'fight pirates' because this area is “international water”)

My comment:
(a) The report cites
薛力：中国有权参与马六甲管理. 环球网, June 8, 2011 (评论 opinion)
http://opinion.huanqiu.com/roll/2011-06/1742703.html
(b) Well, Strait of Malacca is not international waters.

A couple of straits are, but they are so by international treaties. See international waters
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_waters
(section 1 International waterways)

And owners of Strait of Malacca have bared teeth. See
KL tells foreign powers to keep off Malacca Strait. Strait Times (or New Strait Times), Oct 11, 2004.
http://www.paklinks.com/gs/world-affairs/163138-malaysia-tells-foreign-powers-to-stay-away-from-malacca-straits.html
(c) The problem is not a right or not. In wartime, China's access to Strait of Malacca will be denied. A US air force personage once quipped that a missile could interrupt a hypothetical oil pipeline from Myanmar or Pakistan to China.

(2) 台湾纪念＂七七事变＂官热民冷. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/chinese_news/2011/07/110707_tw_77_anniversary.shtml

My comment: The report states, "台湾在民主化前，每逢像是七七事变或金门炮战等周年纪念，经常在官方的主导下成为社会的焦点." To me, it is simply untrue. In Cities of Kaohsiung and Taipei, nobody mentioned 金门炮战 and 七七事变 was a blip--up to 1984 when I left Taiwan for good.

(3)
(a) 香港亚视就误发江泽民去世消息道歉. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011 (GMT 10:05)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/chinese_news/2011/07/110707_china_jiang_hktvapology.shtml
(b) 中国辟谣 日本媒体仍关注江泽民. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011 (GMT 12:01)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/world/2011/07/110707_jp_about_jiangzemin.shtml
("《产经新闻》发出的号外：“江泽民先生去世”，直至周四晚上依然悬挂网络，且高踞最受欢迎新闻前五条")

(4) 俄拟向联合国申明北极主权诉求. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/world/2011/07/110707_russia_arctic.shtml

(5) 英国新航母10年内无机可载. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011
http://www.bbc.co.uk/ukchina/simp/uk_life/2011/07/110707_lift_aircraft_carriers.shtml
("国家审计局的报告说，购买新战机延误投入服役的时间，将造成航空母舰10年没有舰载战机的空档")

My comment: This report is poorly translated, whose title and text suggest lack of AIRCRAFT for a decade--when in fact lack of both aircraft and carrier. Reading an English-language report on this subject will inform you that HMS Queen Elizabeth "will not enter service until 2020, leaving the UK with a decade-long gap without aircraft carrier capability as the existing Invincible class ships and their Harrier jets have been axed." AFP today.  Both HMS Ark Royal (R07), the third and last of Invincible class, and BAE Harrier II retired in March, this year.  

(6) 台湾公布陆客“得与不得”规定. BBC Chinese, July 7, 2011.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/zhongwen/simp/chinese_news/2011/07/110707_taiwan_china_tourist.shtml

(7) 中国和利比亚反对派亲密接触，经济考量多. VOA Chinese, July 7, 2011
http://www.voanews.com/chinese/news/20110707-china-defense-125163914.html
("中国在利比亚问题上开始向西方靠拢")

(8) 马英九: 两岸对于历史诠释应该和解.  VOA Chinese, July 7, 2011
http://www.voanews.com/chinese/news/20110707-ma-on-sino-japanese-war.html
("马英九指出，中国国家主席胡锦涛在2005年抗战60周年时曾表示，国军在前线抗战，敌后协助作战的是中共，马英九说，这才比较接近事实，因为国军是抗战主力。* * * 中央研究院近代史研究员陈仪深教授表示，马英九总统谈到的对日抗战历史确实比较接近事实，不过，台湾现在应该走自己的路，而不是去争中国的正统。



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choi

本文通过一路BBS站telnet客户端发布

Harpoon is A/R/UGM-84.

AGM stands for air-to-ground missile; RGM Radar Guided Missile; UGM Underwater Guided Missile.

(1) Harpoon Block II; Backgrounder. Boeing, undated.
http://www.boeing.com/defense-space/missiles/harpoon/docs/HarpoonBlockIIBackgrounder.pdf

Quote:

"Weight:
1,160 lb. Air configuration
1,459 lb. ASROC configuration
1,520 lb. TARTAR configuration
1,523 lb. Capsule/canister configuration

"Propulsion: Air-breathing turbojet engine (cruise), solid-propellant booster

Note:
(a) RUR-5 ASROC
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RUR-5_ASROC
(for Anti-Submarine ROCket)
(b) TARTAR is acronym for Surface-To-Air Guided Missile Weapon System. Why? I do not know.

For pictures, see
Tartar Guided Missile Fire Control System
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tartar_Guided_Missile_Fire_Control_System


(2)
(a) Capsule.

AGM-84 Harpoon; SLAM [Stand-Off Land Attack Missile]. Federation of American Scientists (FAS), undated.
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/agm-84.htm

Quote:

(a) "Submarines fire a capsule containing the Harpoon from their torpedo tubes. When the capsule breaches the surface, the top is blown off and the missile is launched. * * * The submarine Harpoon is contained within a capsule and is called ENCAP for encapsulated. The ENCAP is the same size and general shape of a blunt nosed torpedo and is launched from submarine torpedo tubes. It has positive buoyancy (it floats), so when it is ejected from the submarine, it will rise to the surface, without power. The ENCAP consists of a nosecap, main body and afterbody. The missile is on shock isolator rails within the main body. The afterbody has fins which direct the ENCAP towards the surface at the proper angle for missile launch. Once the ENCAP breaches the surface, the nosecap is blown off by a small rocket and the missile is launched.

(b) modules:

"The Sustainer Section consists of a fuel tank with JP-10 fuel, air inlet duct, and a jet engine. This provides the thrust to power the missile during sustained flight. The Sustainer Section has four fixed fins which provide lift.

"The Booster Section consists of a solid fuel rocket and arming and firing device. Surface and submarine platforms use a booster to launch Harpoon and propel it to a speed at which sustained flight can be achieved. The Booster Section separates from the missile before sustained flight begins.

My comment: One paragraph of this web page indicates, "An appropriately configured HARPOON can be launched from an AERO-65 bomb rack, AERO-7/A bomb rack, MK 6 canister, MK 7 shock resistant canister, MK 12 thickwall canister, MK 112 ASROC launcher, MK 8 and MK 116 TARTAR launcher, or submarine torpedo tube launcher."

The first two (AERO-65 and -7/A) are on an airplane. From Mark 6 to 116, they are all on surface ships.

(b) Canister.

"When launched from a submarine, the Harpoon is shot out of a torpedo tube in its canister. When the canister leaves the torpedo tube, a lanyard causes the canister to pop out fins, and it then glides upward towards the surface of the water. Once the canister breaches the surface, it blows off its tail and cap and fires the Harpoon on its solid-fuel booster."
[11.1] AGM-84 HARPOON.
http://www.vectorsite.net/twbomb_11.html

* lanyard (n; Middle English lanyer thong): "a piece of rope or line for fastening something in a ship"
www.m-w.com

In the same web page, please also consult two illustrations:
(i) Teledyne CAE J402 Turbojet

Note: An outward appearance of the engine in Sustainer Section:
Teledyne CAE J402-CA-400, 1975
http://www.flickr.com/photos/nostri-imago/2906646234/
("Teledyne CAE began developing the J402-CA-400 (CAE Model 370) in 1972 to power U.S. Navy’s McDonnell Douglas AGM-84A Harpoon, an antiship missile that could be launched from surface ships, aircraft and submarines. A rocket booster stage launched and initially powered the missile; then was jettisoned after burnout. The J402 engine then powered the Harpoon for the rest of its brief flight. Designed as an expendable, short-life engine, the J402 was the first small turbojet missile engine designed for long-term storage without maintenance – for this reason, it has been called a “wooden round” propulsion system. The first production J402 was delivered in 1975. By the early 1990’s, the Harpoon was the most widely deployed missile in the U.S. Navy and was also used by the U.S. Air Force and other naval forces.")

(ii) one with captions of "AGM-64D HARPOON" and "UGM-84D SUB-HARPOON" and text three paragraphs prior to it:

"When fired from a ground battery, ship, or submarine [but NOT from air], the Harpoon is launched into the air with a solid rocket booster that generates 53.9 kN (5,500 kgp / 12,000 lbf) thrust for just under three seconds. The booster adds 75 centimeters (29 inches) to the missile's length and 160 kilograms (350 pounds) to its weight."

A sub-Harpoon is the colloquial for a submarine-launched Harpoon missile.

(c) I can not find any photos or illustrations that show what an capsule or a canister looks like, with or without a missile in situ. I most I can find is this web page, showing two photos of a Harpoon alongside a canister cap. I do not know if I can trust this web site, though.

The Cannister Launch System: Missiles from submarines. (by unknown author(s); undated)
http://www.darkgovernment.com/RANCHO/CRASH/TWA/SYS_CANNISTER.html

Quote:

"The advantage of the cannister system is twofold. Launched via conventional torpedo tube, the system can be retrofitted to existing submarines without vertical launch tubes (such as the older 688 boats), and the delay in the cannister's rise to the surface allows the submarine to clear datum, so that the actual missile firing does not reveal the submarine's true location.

"Meanwhile, its worth noting that the enhanced type 688 submarine includes 12 vertical launch tubes forward of the sail which are admitted to handle Tomahawk and Harpoon. The Mark 41 surface launcher handles Tomahawk and Harpoon and Sea Sparrow and Standards with the same sized tube.

Note: For 688, see Los Angeles class submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_class_submarine
(also called 688 class; is a class of nuclear-powered fast attack submarines (SSN); Succeeded by: Virginia class attack submarine; Built: 1972 – 1996; In commission: 1976 – present)


(3)
(a) This is a web page from Strategic Systems Programs (SSP), US Navy, which does not deal with Harpoon but Tomahawk. It appears that the same principles is employed to launch Tomahawk missile from a submarine.

The British Strategic Systems Programs (under Facts: Polaris-Poseidon-Trident), undated.
http://www.ssp.navy.mil/about/history_facts_6.shtml

Quote:

"The TOMAHAWK missile, while onboard the SSGN, is encapsulated within the legacy Capsule Launching System (CLS). The CLS provides environmental protection, missile ejection using a gas generator, and an umbilical cable for communication with the shipboard components. This configuration is referred to as the TOMAHAWK All-Up- Round (AUR).

"Multiple All-Up-Round Canister (MAC)
The MAC structurally supports seven TOMAHAWK All Up Rounds (AURs) or AUR ballast cans, and interfaces with the existing OHIO Class missile tube. The MAC supports the AURs both vertically and radially at the upper flange and provides radial support for the capsule at three specific elevations to align with the exterior AUR shock pads. The MAC also provides an upper seal between itself and the missile tube, and seals between itself and individual AURs or AUR ballast cans. These seals prevent water from entering the missile tube below the MAC.

(b) cruise missile submarine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruise_missile_submarine

Quote:

"SSGN is the United States Navy hull classification symbol for a nuclear-powered cruise missile submarine[, where t]he SS denotes 'Ship, Submersible' (i.e. submarine), the G denotes 'guided missile'

"From 2002 to 2008 the U.S. Navy modified the four oldest Ohio-class Trident submarines to SSGN configuration. The conversion was achieved by installing vertical launching systems (VLS) in a configuration dubbed 'multiple all-up-round canister (MAC).' This system was installed in 22 of the 24 missile tubes, replacing one large nuclear strategic ballistic missile with 7 smaller Tomahawk cruise missiles. The 2 remaining tubes were converted to lockout chambers (LOC) to be used by special forces personnel who can be carried on board. This gives each converted sub the capability to carry up to 154 Tomahawk missiles. The MAC tubes can also be used to carry and launch UAVs or UUVs which give the ship remote controlled "eyes & ears" allowing the ship to act as a forward-deployed command & control center.


(4) History of submarine launched missile.

Submarine-launched ballistic missile came out first before submarine-launched cruise or guided missile.

submarine-launched ballistic missile
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine-launched_ballistic_missile
("Soviet Union making its first successful underwater launch of a submarine ballistic missile in the White Sea on 10 September 1960 from the same converted Project 611 ([NATO designation:] Zulu Class) submarine that first launched the R-11FM (SS-N-1 Scud-A, naval modification of SS-1 Scud) on 16 September 1955. The United States made the first successful underwater launch of a Polaris on 20 July 1960 (40 days previously))

However, Soviet Union's Sept 15, 1955 success was from an emerged submarine. See
Norman Polmar, Jurrien Noot, Submarines of the Russian and Soviet Navies,1718-1990. Naval Institute Press, 1991, at page 154
http://books.google.com/books?id=7cDN8q2RHGMC&pg=PA154&lpg=PA154&dq=submarine+launch+missile+canister&source=bl&ots=TGL_STDnw9&sig=8euJJ8CQdpZabadR5CkumKKHSkc&hl=en&ei=fhAXTqXUIcbpgAeuloT-Dw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDsQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=submarine%20launch%20missile%20canister&f=false
("The first submarine missile firing from teh surfaced Zulu took place in September 1955")


(5) Ultimately I have no idea whether Taiwan launches Harpoon or HF-2 from torpedo tube or vertical launch system (VLS).


【 在 choi 的大作中提到: 】
: 羅添斌, 潛射雄二測評 劍龍級潛艦大升級. Liberty Times, July 7, 2011.
: http://www.libertytimes.com.tw/2011/new/jul/7/today-p1.htm
: My comment: I read the news upon its publication at 3 pm. My impression was Taiwan's aim was aspirational, rather than a reality. After all,
: (以下引言省略...)

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